Help need with backup test
Hi. As a test I made a Disk Backup with Aomei in Windows XP and then used that backup to try and restore Windows XP to a spare drive. All seemed to go well until a reboot and I got this message "loader error 3." Has anyone else experienced this? Windows will not load now. Thanks!
Comments
"loader error 3"This is the error of Windows, please try to search the detailed solutions in Google or ask help with Microsoftware. Sorry for the inconvenience.
This problem only occurs with the drive to which the image is restored to. The original drive works just fine. It may be a windows error, but it seems Aomei is the cause.
Question for Admin and Blackhawk.
Spare drive. Suppose it was formatted as GPT instead of MBR. It will restore but of course it will not boot on XP. Will a disk restore made from a disk backup automatically change a GPT formatted disk into MBR (or MBR to GPT) or will it stay the way it was.....? With system and partition restore it will not. Don't know about disk restore.
Blackhawk, can you check the current style via an other computer?
It was GPT, but I saw the warning in Aomei there could be issues with a backup so I used DISKPART and converted it to "Basic" NTFS before the restore. Now both drives, the original, and the spare drive are Basic NTFS, Healthy System status. I did a quick look and noticed that the spare drive has a boot.ini file in the root of C and the drive that works just fine does not. I wonder if this is the issue? Delete the boot.ini from the root of C and see if the spare drive will be ok now?
This is the contents of the boot.ini file in question, the one on the spare drive...
[boot loader]
timeout=30
default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS
[operating systems]
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP Professional" /fastdetect /NoExecute=OptIn
If disk is GPT if can only boot on 64 bit Win8 or Win10 with UEFI based computer. Never on XP. It can't even be used as a data disk on WinXP 32 bits. (data disk only on XP-64 or Vista-32 and up)
NTFS is a format style, that is something different than a GPT/MBR disk. The latter refers to a way partitions are configurated: BIOS or UEFI: MBR or GPT; <=Win7 or >=Win8.
So you first have to convert the GPT to MBR style disk. Therefore you need to wipe all the partitions first. That can be hard in disk management because often it won't let you delete system/hidden partitions. Can only be achieved with Diskparts Clean command. Be very careful with this. Google for info on Diskpart Clean command/
Something like:
diskpart
list disk
select disk # (carefully selecting the right disk # )
clean
convert mbr
exit
Then restore XP again.
BlackHawk wrote: >>I used DISKPART and converted it to "Basic" NTFS
Such a command does not exist in diskpart. In addition on Windows XP diskpart does not exist. Imprecise, when asking for help and randomly opening computers and plugin-in and unplugging disk devices.
It canot be the GPT issue because it would not be able to boot into the error message, would not show Loader Error 3. BIOS would show No system disk Press Any Key. Obviously it boots into the original or the replacement disk, but cannot proceed.
I suggest also checking that the replacement disk goes at the exact place of the original disk (IDE, SATA) and has the same jumper settings (IDE), and that the original disk is out of the computer, that is unplugged.
In addition, Loader Error 3 in Windows XP and Windows 2K has this explanation, which also cannot occur by a simple restore:
Software Loader 3 error is caused by the system registry hive. It may
be corrupted or may be too large to launch. There is a limitation to the
total available space on loading the drivers in the registry key
HKLM\SYSTEM\CCS\Services. On some instances, or in your situation, there
is no enough space to start the drivers so your computer stops and give
you the same error. When a device or any drive has been removed from
your computer, Windows 2000 remains the registry entries just in case
you will put the device back to your system. This is part of the Plug
and Play feature. The issue can be obtain when the set of drivers has
been reconfigured. If they will be detected and create duplicates. And
therefore if the drive grows larger or over 700, you are most likely to
receive this error.
To fix this, you need the Windows 2000 Recovery Console disk. Boot from
it and then change the present system hive in the WINNT\SYSTEM32\CONFIG
and then change it with a smaller one from the WINNT\REPAIR hive so you
can boot into it. Once done, it is possible to load the default hive
and check what is taking too much space in your hive.
Loader Error 3 can be googled out. The only reasonable explanation that SYSTEM was near the limit before and has passed the limit with the extra disk, if it really hit the 700 devices limit.
It is good to have noticed two differences between Original and Replacement disk, but the conclusion is this: It doesn't make sense that boot.ini is invisible on the original disk, but is visible after Disk Recovery (restore) on the replacement disk (as seen on some other, unknown to us, computer with unspecified Windows version). That's a failed restore, overall, or perhaps a failed backup. I assume there are other destructions, where original and replacement disk (after restore) are different, or backup and original do not match.
It would be helpful to learn how the Backup and how the Recovery were done, just to get an idea.
BlackHawk ,Sorry for all of that. It is causeed maybe becuase our software. Sorry again.Your spare drive is GPT, how about the disk you backuped? MBR? Di you change the boot mode? Is it ok for you now?
I first must say that I appreciate ALL of the replies.
Actually such a command does exist in Diskpart and it is: "At the DISKPART prompt, type:
convert basic" Diskpart does exist in Windows XP Pro, I used it. If you don't believe me, here's a link straight from Microsoft showing it does exist...
https://www.microsoft.com/resources/documentation/windows/xp/all/proddocs/en-us/dm_revert_disk.mspx?mfr=true
You are right, it is not GPT. It was GPT until I converted it to "basic" with Diskpart. The original drive was taken out and the spare drive was put in the exact same place with the exact same SATA cables. AOMEI will restore the Disk Backup to the spare drive just fine. I get into Windows and can work there with no issues. The issue occurs when I shut the computer down or reboot. That is when I get the "loader error 3" message.
I agree Peter, it doesn't make sense that boot.ini is invisible on the original disk,
but is visible after Disk Recovery (restore) on the replacement disk. Both drives are being put into a Dell Optiplex GX520 that has Windows XP Pro as it's OS. I only hooked up 1 drive at a time... a Disk Backup of the original drive was made with AOMEI Backupper and sent to an external Western Digital drive that was hooked up via USB. I then took out the original drive and replaced it with the spare drive. I hooked up the Western Digital drive via USB, put the AOMEI windows boot disk in and proceeded to restore the Disk Backup that was on the Western Digital drive to the spare drive. As I said everything goes well and I can work in Windows. The problem occurs if I shut down or reboot. That is when I get the "loader error 3" message.
NOTE to the Admin: I appreciate your help, but neither drive is GPT. As i said above the spare drive was GPT until I converted it. The original drive is not GPT either. Please tell me what I need to do to get this information to you so you can see exactly what they are.
Here is a screen shot of the spare drive taken after the AOMEI restore, BEFORE the reboot and subsequent "loader error 3" message...
I want to solve this and I would hope AOMEI would as well.
Ok I just went into Windows XP Pro, Device Manager, Disk Drives, then I right click on both drives in question, went to Properties, went to the Volumes Tab, clicked Populate and BOTH drives show up as Partion Style: Master Boot Record (MBR). I wonder why I had to click populate for this information to show? It was all blank fields before I clicked on poulate. I noticed the same thing in Windows 7 Home Edition 64 bit... I have to click on poulate to see what the Partition Style is. Even inWindows 7 my partion style is MBR
So to understand right, after the restore the first boot goes well, but the first shutdown produces Loader Error 3. Then you restore again, the first boot goes well, but the first Restart produces Loader Error 3.
And yes there is convert basic, but it is not converting from gpt to mbr, but from dynamic to basic, and on your screenshots no one can see that the disk in question is mbr. The amount of computers you have and the intensity of testing you would know how to find out it is gpt or mbr.
"Like basic disks, dynamic disks can use the MBR or GPT partition styles on systems
that support both." from Microsoft https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/aa363785(v=vs.85).aspx
Yes that is correct... "the restore the first boot goes well, but the first shutdown produces
Loader Error 3. Then you restore again, the first boot goes well, but
the first Restart produces Loader Error 3"
Did you see post #11 where I explained that it is positively MBR and not GPT? As you even said earlier if it was GPT it wouldn't have booted in the first place. Earlier in the thread I said it was originally GPT and I did Diskpart to change it, but you insisted Diskpart didn't have a command I spoke of and Diskpart didn't even exist on XP Pro it yet it does. So we both learned something no?
Post #11 was simultaneous with my #12 (earlier it was basic disk). I never needed diskpart in XP because PartitionMagic and other tools were available (no one ever mentioned diskpart).
I suggest that you verify the limit given in #8, the registry entry is mentioned there. All these questions about Loader Error 3 in the Internet are that it appeared suddently on a working system. Yours also falls into this category: hardware change, drivers renewed. Microsoft KB also has information about Loader Error 3 https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/277222Here is another one https://groups.google.com/forum/?hl=en#!topic/microsoft.public.win2000.setup/pvW-zMl9XNU
There is another question, how large are the original and the replacement disk? Another Loader Error 3 discussion was about a disk too large to be properly handled by bios. I know not from your Dell, but from my Dell that it had a limit of around 187GB or so.
As far as SATA PORT is concern, there is no restriction on the port but
on the whole build of the system. You can put more than 500 Gb on the
SATA port but due to the design of the system board, it can cause an
issue. There are other optiplex system which can handle more than 500 Gb
and if these is the need of the user, they are offered with this
machine and not the system which can only handle 500 GB.
If you install more than 500 GB, the system may not POSt or slows down.
http://www.experts-exchange.com/questions/24945655/Dell-Optiplex-GX520-Max-HDD.html
However the replacement disk is just 80GB, from #10
It would be helpful to verify by #8 the size of C:\Windows\system32\config\system , which is an invisible and protected system file. On my plain Windows XP it is 2.75MB. C:\Windows\repair\system is 1.19MB.
BlackHawk , Sorry for that, maybe this file called ntldr is corrupted when it do the restore. But we hope you can help us to find the problem.
1, Please restore the disk again.
2, Boot it again.
3, Create the WinPE with another software, and then search the file "ntldr" under the boot directory of C partition to copy it out. And send it to us.
4, Find the image you do for the backup and explore it. Then find the "ntldr" in the image to send to us.
5, After we received those two "ntldr" file, we will analyse it.
6, Hope you can help us.
Thank you for the reply. I want to get some things clarified...
#1. I did make the WinPE with another program outside of the one built into AOEMI Backupper. I made it with EZ CD Audio Converter.
#2. I can get you the "ntldr" file from the original good working Windows XP Pro install and I can also get you the "ntldr" file from the image I made with AOMEI Backupper.
#3. I will also need to get you the "ntldr" file from the restore that is giving me the "Loader Error 3" error?
It would be helpful to verify by #8 the size of
C:\Windows\system32\config\system , which is an invisible and protected
system file. On my plain Windows XP it is 2.75MB.
C:\Windows\repair\system is 1.19MB.
And you can compare the two or three ntldr yourself, besides if ntldr is corrupt then loader Error 3 could not appear due to the corruption. Here are instructions to compare files from the command line with FC
http://www.howtogeek.com/206123/how-to-use-fc-file-compare-from-the-windows-command-prompt/
EZ CD Audio Converter is not able to create Windows PE (except of course burning a ready ISO), by its website. Plz clarify for me, interested, what you have done.
Thanks Peter. Yes, I used EZ CD Audio Converter to burn the ready ISO file, not create it.
I can say that the ntldr files are the same size at 244kb each. That's all I can say about that.
I did a right click properties on the "C:\Windows\system32\config" folder and the good drive says...
Size: 33.7 mb
Size on disk: 33.8 mb
Contains: 78 files, 42 folders
The drive giving me the Error 3 messages says this...
Size: 34.4 mb
Size on disk: 34.6 mb
Contains: 80 files, 42 folders.
Does this information help?
no, #19, asked the size of the file named SYSTEM in that folder.
yes #20, can you send me both disks and I will analyze it further? I'm sure I find it when I get the disks into my hands.
Would you please tell me how the backup was done? You said a few things in #10 but it is not enough to repeat it.
What version of Backupper? And was the backup done from the bootable media? what version is the bootable media (AIK edition, Backupper version used to create it)?
The following points are clear: Restore was done from the bootable media, this was said. And the 80GB disk was GPT (which is somehow strange for such a small, old disk), but nevertheless then converted to basic, in Windows XP, not from the bootable media (because of the discussion about diskpart exists in Windows XP. And only one disk was attached at any one time)..